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View Full Version : Why choose to max perf over phoenix shot?



AxeAce
April 13th, 2010, 08:39 PM
Granted it has been 2 years since I last played, but if i remember correctly I preferred phoenix shot over perf for two reasons:

1. Phoenix is an aoe too, you just have to wait a second long. Doesn't it's aoe damage at level 10 do more than perf level 10? Could save a bunch of skill points.
2. Phoenix shot can be used to "nuke" players in PvP...I remember it doing a ton of damage.

Downside is that it's a mana drain, but you're going to run out of mana as an archer no matter what...

icetaylor
April 13th, 2010, 10:17 PM
phoenix shot is much slower at firing because of the charge time
also, perforation provides a boosted 30% of critical :O which helps alot
personally thought, level both xD use ps to "nuke" players in pvp, and perfo for aoeing mobs

minkwarrior
April 13th, 2010, 11:41 PM
Here's an example of the use of Perforation in Bless Castle:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WbzgyUj6GY

In relation to the video, Enigma Force stacks with my attack power so it boosts the Perforation skill right? Because someone discussed that forces don't stack on your attack power when you use Perforation. I would have just used Perf without really using force at all. It's a silly question so please correct me if I'm mistaken.

icetaylor
April 14th, 2010, 12:12 AM
yea forces dont stack with perfo

Chislev
April 14th, 2010, 11:38 AM
- forces does NOT have effect on phoenix shot when used in charged mode (AoE) They only work when using it in normal mode (forces do not stack with any AoE skill)

- Perforation is spammable AoE, PS (aoe) is not.

- Perforation has a lot less mana usage per shot, meaning you can shot several more times with one energy bar.

- While PS will hit in AoE a wider area, it will be shorter (less range) than perforation, in training situations you are moving back while shoting, hence monsters tend to be in a long line, not in a wide group. On the other hand, PS is good if you have someone else tanking a large group of enemies and you want to hit AoE on them.

- Perforation causes knowck back on enemies (helpful thing) while PS doesn't

- no difference about skill points, perforation use normal SPs, PS needs EPs, and you can have Perf maxed out way bofere you can even get PS 5.


PS can be really good for 1v1, very fast, high damage, but the cost in mana and stamina is incredibly high, maybe too high, to speak the truth, to make it a normal use skill. Usually i like PS as the "quick kill" skill, specially good for the stronger monsters and boss fighting. As for PvP, it is the best skill for archer without any doubt.

Erbse
April 15th, 2010, 08:07 AM
Bottom line, Perforation nets more overall damage while it's easier and saver to use.

PS is a solid skill and can be used for AoE grinding if you want to spend the points you usually spend on Perforation elsewhere.

As far as the force questions go. Force do NOT stack with Perforation nor a CHARGED Phoenix Shot.

minkwarrior
April 16th, 2010, 05:02 AM
Now THAT'S a clear explanation. Thanks Erbse! :)

ReyJunZ
April 16th, 2010, 10:15 PM
so donate your enigma force to me bro earl , then i can boost my cs !! lol

minkwarrior
April 21st, 2010, 04:35 AM
NO! Nevah! I need my forces for 1 vs 1. You're on top of my BP list :evil:

Shinrikyo
April 21st, 2010, 10:25 AM
Wasn't there the additional advantage that Perfo can crit (and adds crit), whereas a charged PS can't crit? I'm not 100% sure, but i have that somehow stuck in my mind...

Eudoxia
April 21st, 2010, 10:54 AM
Wasn't there the additional advantage that Perfo can crit (and adds crit), whereas a charged PS can't crit? I'm not 100% sure, but i have that somehow stuck in my mind...

hi bow cousin <3

yep, and i think that was mentioned here too. ^^ overall... Perfo wins over Phoenix Shot! i don't think i've ever seen an archer train using AoE Phoenix Shot. O__O and i think if i did i would stop and stare for quite a while

minkwarrior
April 21st, 2010, 06:37 PM
If you're defending the castle, investing on critical scrolls is your best bet when using Perforation rather than using Sheltom Force. Keeps the BP rollin' :XD:

Rainmakr
April 29th, 2010, 07:46 PM
get both maxed out and stop complainin bout mana consumption :P

Lotify
June 15th, 2010, 12:44 PM
I did chose max both

perf is good in SOD. and low level training
but perf not works well in high level map(ICE map above)
feeling like mage skill.


I only use Phoenix shot on training in ET.
that is my favourite archer skill and no others

that require alot of mana points
i have 112 spirit and can do 11 shot without anything

with mana recharge and mana down, can do 30-60 phoenix shot with 1 pot(due to gap of respawn mobs)

and phoenix shot is best one for valento hunting.(also Mokova hunting, but never join Kelvezu hunting)

feeling very well with that slaughtering. :awsum:


the only problem is phoenix shot not only needs mana and also alot ot stamina. I usually spend 300-500 stamina pots per hour in ET map.


DO NOT use avalanche that stupid skill in high level map.
you cannot move during skill. whatever how pro your control, you may fail by this skill.


in BC.
I'm sure perf is better than charged Phoenix shot when "bridge war"(and similar)

1 on 1, phoenix shot is the best. that is the 3rd strongest damage output after CS and destroyer due to no cool down time.



Meztique

Chislev
June 15th, 2010, 10:51 PM
DO NOT use avalanche that stupid skill in high level map.
you cannot move during skill. whatever how pro your control, you may fail by this skill.


Thank you! Now i can die in peace at anytime, i lived long enough to read someone else say what i've been saying since that dumb skill came out, thank you thank you thank you, i really mean it, thank you :D


After that moment of unleashed euphoria, yes, PS and STM are not a great combo haha, when i use them it takes about 2 or 3 mana pots to kill a mob, but i need a truck full of stm to back me up lol I guess the same happen to other classes, on my ata i have the same issues with stamina all the time, i guess they made the potions too small or in some part of the developing they have forgotten how to count and that's why we need so insane amounts of stm pots haha

MaMyPoKoPanTs
June 16th, 2010, 12:04 AM
So other than using ava and PS to hunt, any other skill can be use for hunting in high lvl maps?

Lotify
June 17th, 2010, 07:12 AM
i like wind arrow :p

Bump: but still lv1

tried lvl 10 cannot continuous

Nnoitra
June 17th, 2010, 07:46 AM
i like wind arrow :p

Bump: but still lv1

tried lvl 10 cannot continuous

max lvl that can fire continuous is lvl 7, best lvls for wind arrow are 1, 4 and 7

Chislev
June 17th, 2010, 11:56 AM
Wind Arrow is good, i also like (probably i'm the only one who likes this skill) elemental shot.

Nnoitra
June 17th, 2010, 04:05 PM
Wind Arrow is good, i also like (probably i'm the only one who likes this skill) elemental shot.

Nothing wrong with liking a skill :XD: but sadly that doesnt make it good :mad: it adds a fixed amount of dmg, which is probbly good on lower lvls, but on higher lvls a skill that adds x% dmg, which is based on your base attack power, will simply add a lot more dmg

Lotify
June 18th, 2010, 12:48 AM
this game is designed in

Normal Attack with some kill cast( like monster )

in old PT time, we most time use only normal attack.(default attack)
that don't need alot of mana and stamina

but now we need more stamina cause we cast skill all the time.

maybe should change class to reduce all skill stamina points required.

Chislev
June 18th, 2010, 12:05 PM
That is quite true. Most of the time i see people don't even use normal attack. I like to use normal attack most of the time, but most times when i'm in a party (actually a pretty rare situation considering i play in midranda) people start to "look bad" at you if you are not a skill spammer.

Anyways, i like normal attack and specially because it has way better criticals than those done in skills, it is also a more relaxed way to play :)

MaMyPoKoPanTs
June 19th, 2010, 02:03 PM
But using lvl 7 WA cost more manas than using Ava....Ava helps u to boosts back ur manas while WA does not.

Eudoxia
June 19th, 2010, 02:16 PM
Anyways, i like normal attack and specially because it has way better criticals than those done in skills, it is also a more relaxed way to play :)

actually that's wrong. ^^ you have the same critical using normal attack as you do using WA or AVA, but you end up shooting at a much higher speed, so you will eventually have MORE critical hits. i've aged many many bows using WA and AVA, and it ages faster using skills than using normal attack.

and FoN does work with PS, it only doesn't work with perfo or if your charging PS. FoN is a skill that you benefit from more with multiple hits, cause it only adds 40min and 40max, so of course you wouldn't notice much of a difference trying to 1-hit monsters o.O it's over multiple hits that you will benefit more from the damage

DamnItsWiggle
June 19th, 2010, 02:39 PM
actually that's wrong. ^^ you have the same critical using normal attack as you do using WA or AVA, but you end up shooting at a much higher speed, so you will eventually have MORE critical hits. i've aged many many bows using WA and AVA, and it ages faster using skills than using normal attack.

and FoN does work with PS, it only doesn't work with perfo or if your charging PS. FoN is a skill that you benefit from more with multiple hits, cause it only adds 40min and 40max, so of course you wouldn't notice much of a difference trying to 1-hit monsters o.O it's over multiple hits that you will benefit more from the damage
I love girls who are knowledgeable :3

LeighTzu
June 19th, 2010, 02:56 PM
I love girls who are knowledgeable :3

Creeper alert.:D

Chislev
June 20th, 2010, 08:37 PM
actually that's wrong. ^^ you have the same critical using normal attack as you do using WA or AVA, but you end up shooting at a much higher speed, so you will eventually have MORE critical hits. i've aged many many bows using WA and AVA, and it ages faster using skills than using normal attack.

and FoN does work with PS, it only doesn't work with perfo or if your charging PS. FoN is a skill that you benefit from more with multiple hits, cause it only adds 40min and 40max, so of course you wouldn't notice much of a difference trying to 1-hit monsters o.O it's over multiple hits that you will benefit more from the damage

Sorry, i was meaning that i actually notice and hear the cool sound of criticals with normal attack while there is no way to actually "enjoy" them when coming from other skills, my bad for miss-expressing myself.

On the FON part, i disagree, i have used it for hour and hour and i did not notice any umprovement and i used it at level 10 so the difference should be a real lot noticeable, not noticing such a difference after it was maxed out already means it is worthless, again this is my point of view and could be seen in a different way, but i have found way more "profitable" to max whatever else first and drop points into fon when there is nothing else to waste EPs in.

Eudoxia
June 21st, 2010, 11:16 AM
X'D *waves at Wiggle* welcome back to PT you crazy thing!!!

Chrislev: personally i think that's the beauty of tier 4 ^^ tier 1-3 for archers is REALLLLYYYY straight forward. the only skills you should ever invest in are Shooting Mastery, WA/AVA, Perfo, Birds, and as a last resort Dions Eye. tier 4 is so flexible!

for tier 4 many skills can be considered "useless" as you say based off how you play. =o for example, evade is useless for me. and phoenix shot is almost just as useless, since i refuse to spam mana or spend millions of gold or time hunting it. FoN is like an extra force. ^^ if you think FoN is useless, you might as well think a dev force is useless. they may add a fraction of your attack power, but when its all combined together that's where i counts =o

why should i add skill points to evade when i either always have a tank or am 1v1? when i perfo level, i kill in an area that i can handle and i'd only die if i'm doing something stupid. so i dont need to dodge attacks. many archers are like that ^^

and when you're hunting 1v1, to me a high level wolf is better than evasion. it will stay alive longer for you to kill the monster, will damage the monster, and only when it dies will you be needing evasion for the 4 seconds it takes to summon another one (and that's if the monster is ranged). otherwise you shouldn't be getting hit very often.

i think all the skills are important for tier 4... you just really have to know your archer and your playing style <3 i think evasion is wonderful, but only if it suits your playing style.

Chislev
June 21st, 2010, 11:35 AM
Very valid opinion, Eudoxia.

I think you just hit the nail there: "How do we play" For me it is better to max dions instead of ava, the reason is simple, i solo and there are ranged mobs everywhere, so while i burn one avalanche i will get hit 3 times, which would effectively and undoubtly kill me; here is where/when evade comes into play as well, it is the only real defence archers has agains ranged mobs, from the witches in ice map to the archers at LoC, seto's in LC and archers, atalantas, priestesses and magicians in ET.

But when you play just as a fire support class those problems disapear most of the time since it will be someone else who get the monster's attention. IF archers could evade ranged shots better then i may chose a different skillset as well, maybe even would use avalanche, but since they get seriously raped by anged mobs i have to say that evade is a lot more useful at high level than FoN, again for solo playing.

Erbse
June 25th, 2010, 01:26 PM
FoN behaves like forces, useless on AoE but applied on single target abilities. I don't know the stacking order however, which could end up FoN only being a +40 static damage to an abilities damage rather than being included in any %-boosts. Still, even after the buff I'd go with Evasion and PS, unless one's 102 or not leveling that is.

Dion's Eye is solely applied on your Bow's ATR and not your total ATR, making it a moot ability. Rather go with Scout Falcon if you desire ridiculous ATR - granted though, it's a nuisance that needs to be upheld manually. Alternatively give up both and pick up Falcons, both will eventually be more worth while than Dion's however.

Also, I think you guys deserve a B. Sc. Degree for having figured out that more shots in a preset time frame obviously cause more critical hits to happen than less shots in the same frame would. Overall however the chance of causing a critical hit remains the same, obviously.