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View Full Version : X-Rage as a 1on1 Attack and other Non-Vengence Builds



Viseris
February 14th, 2010, 05:34 PM
Hi everyone. I'm going to post my experiences with my Atalanta. I like the build at lot, even though many brush off X-rage as a useless skill. Is it the most effective Ata-build? No, you definately won't be out damaging a Vengeance Ata.

The use of prioritizing in Frost/X-rage and (HoV Ofcourse, which is a necessity) imo, means that the Ata is going for a more tanker or support build. Ata's CAN tank period. The are the only class that uses a shield 100% of the time in battle. Why use hit and run tactics, overall lowering your dmg when you have to run away? We are not archers, will never outdamage an archer (even Syn-FMA wearers).

Ok first I'm going to talk about the Hov and Frost Javelin Build

1) Hov and Frost Javelin each at level 10 by 10x (100).

Baaly, and some others (the minority) have some experience with this build. I also feel it would be effective, as you can greatly decrease the speed of ANY monster you attack. Our damage won't be too great because we are using regular melee attacks, practically every monster anyways. However with the reduction in speed of the monsters 13% at level 10 opposed to 4% at level 1, tanking should be no problem at all.

1on1 Attacks. Okay, so we don't have vegenance. How do we kill monsters? Split Jav 7-10 and maybe Twisted Jav (which I find very weak compared to the MP Cost required). AoE'S? Storm javelin most likely at level 1 or close, as we have to invest points into Split and most likely Twisted, to have a 1on1 attack we can spam.

2) Hov and X-Rage at level 10 by 10x (100)

Probably a build that 0.1%( or maybe even 0% beside me) of Ata's use. Why? Well, everyone laments X-rage for its lack of spammability, (i.e "huge" delay) weak damage compared to storm (which is true if it's left at level 1 most ata's probably dont' have it mapped) and the fact that 99% of ata's go for the cookie cutter 10 Hov 10 Vengence combination (req 102).

Specifically, I'll be leaving X-rage at level 8-9 depending on how satisfied I am with the area/dmg and putting 1 point into Frost Javelin (FJ 2), just so its better than level 1. Hov Maxed by 10x, obviously.

X-Rage an Overlooked Skill

Okay, X-Rage at level 1 is weak...and should not be used over Storm Javelin spam. Heck, you can't even do much with it, if you don't plan on investing in the skill. Right now my X-Rage is level 6, and the damage/area is still not to my liking. However, I use the skill whenever it is up (about 10 sec delay give or take) due to its unforeseen "versatility".

Like I said earlier, X-Rage is still a little weak for me at level 6 (I'm level 82, i.e. low agility and stats on my spiked are crap), but I'm bringing it to 9 more likely than not. You may ask why? You may tell me the vengenace build is superior (which I'm quite positive it is, thank you). I already know this. Do I need to do insane damage at an ata....I don't imo, and I'll explain. If an ata plays the role of a hit and run archer...what do they become? Weak Archers...doing less damage than an archer...tanking a little better but still running :P What do I call an Ata that runs....and archer...and a weak one at that. Some are likely to disagree, and that's fine. I'm sure those who know bear (10x ata wearing Fma/Syn whatever it is) may disagree. But it comes down to class roles and how you want to play your character. What does a low str/base health Ata provide? The support of Hov yes, Ice Javelin 1, yes. Damage, yes. Tanking....no. What does a typically low str archer build provide? FoN support, while not as good as Hov obviously, its still support. Damage...better than ata's no matter their build, and constant damage more than probably any class in the game with the proper tank. Extra Tank/Mob distractor/Additional dmg with Wolf and Falcon summons, something an Ata cannot do. Archers and some Ata's have insane dmg output. But keep in mind, when they play the hit and run game, they lose DPS.

Alright, I'm going on a rant here. I apologize for that. Nonetheless, I have additional info/tactics on X-Rage. Yes. X-Rage can be used as a 1on1 attack at high levels unlike 99% of AoE skills (sans Meteor). Why? It strikes 3 times with a high damage boost, and while it doesn't benefit from forces, it comes out fast, roughly in the time 1 throw of Storm javelin can come out. Also I use it to chain into other attacks. X-Rage into Split and X-Rage into Storm Javelin, alot more fun to me than spamming Vengeance and Storm exclusively. Second, it stuns all monsters in the area for a second, and works wonders with shield strike.

Also, it is quite capable of attacking monsters in a 360 degree radius around you in a tanking situation, therefore, it is not necessary to move in order to use AoE's in a tanking situation.

Here's my skill list, (keep in mind I'm level 82)
10 Throwing
10 TOV
7 Split (debating whether to take this to 10 or not)
5 Windy (to 10 eventually)
2 Twist Jav (used on demons exclusively)
Storm Jav 1 (If I do raise it, it'll be to about 4 max)
1 Lightning Jav (used on undead exclusively, provides push back, small area dmg)
1 Fire Jav (Seems weak to me against mutants, but I have to test the dmg again)

5 HOV (Level 10 by 100)
6 X-Rage (8-9 by Level 90)
1 Frost (2-3 by level 90)
0 Vengeance

As a recap...and I trying to convert all Ata's to X-Rage/Frost users? No. Is it more effective than the standard 10 Hov/10 Vengeance build? I'm quite sure it isn't. Do I use less MP? Yes. Can I use all skills whenver they are up (Split/X-Rage), and rely on less mana pots? Yes. Am I at "full power" 100% of the time compared to Vengeance 1on1 every mob (Heavily dependent on how much mana/Stm you carry) for the most part. Do I do less damage than Vengeance Ata's when they can spam, Yes. Can I tank better, yes (I plan to raise HP more than most).

I'm considering dropping to 36 spirit if I can infact, spam X-Rage and Split 100% (and 3 buffs) of the time in a grind situation. Maybe 9x-10x with some more invested in HP, and greater mp regen from levels.

Maybe I have more to add, and we'll see what others fellow Ata's have to say, but I have fun with this build, and no one will convince me to switch to a Veng Ata. If I'm having fun, and the game is engaging, that's all I care about. My primary point was to shed light on the fact that there ARE other Ata builds out there other than Veng/Hov of which the majority use.

Chislev
February 14th, 2010, 07:51 PM
I'm glad to read that i'm not the only one who likes x-rage.... but usually saying that would trigger a rain of "negative comments" on me so i keep it silent most of the time.

The difference to my skill build is that i still plan to have vengeance 10 @10x, but i will leave HoV on level 5 and raise Xrage, it is a sort of non highly specialized skill build... let¡s say that i'm not all that "in love" with HoV, it has too short duration to justify it at level 10 and i do not need the extra evasion, can tank every area in my level range without even castin hov, so that's why i decided to invest on the nicest looking ata skill ever done xD

On my main ata i'm not using neither HoV nor Frost. no HoV for the previously stated reasons. As for Frost, i understand that it only affect normal attacks, i've never noticed any difference in damage between using frost or not using it while spamming skills, since my ata is a skill spammer it doesn't make any good for me, which leaves a lot of nice EPs to boost both vengeance and xrage.

On my secondary Ata, i don't have any of those problems since she's a tier-1 build :p Just to remember the old old old days :D

I believe that what is most important is not to get to the last drop of performance out of our characters but to have fun playing them. I for myself never liked to play what everyone else is playing. I'm 100% sure that there are still lot of possible unique builds to play with, they just need people like you to be brave enough to try finding them.

Oh, a tip on Lighting Jav (nice skill btw) it is awesome to fast recover of mana when using a Mana Recharge, just throw a couple of them on a tight spawn and you will have full bar again :)

What i'm not sure if i share is your idea on the 36 spirit... i believe that the lowest necessary to have a nice performance in any situation is around 40 (the req. for a nice ats raident). But with your playing style it could work.

Anyways, it is great to read some freash and different ideas around here!!

andersc
February 15th, 2010, 02:01 AM
about spirit:

i got a lvl 59 ata:XD:

more worse is that it got 72 spirit!!!
i simply go for lower str, higher spirit. this means much better spamming,
and less mana use. in boa i can spam storm, and use a bit of mana,
but then i find what i just used:D

because i only got 10.5kk and never have had more,:'(
i don't want to buy mana.

someone else should try this,
then with tov 10 hov 5 and x-rage:awsum:

i think this would be a pretty nice build.

Nnoitra
February 15th, 2010, 07:44 AM
The delay on X rage is just way to high
And frost jav is useless in lvl 90+ maps, so that leaves you with 2 other skills who are both good :D

Chislev
February 15th, 2010, 10:37 AM
That's another excellent point against frost, Nnoitra. It still slow down most enemies, but well... that skill is a booby trap.

Bump:

someone else should try this,
then with tov 10 hov 5 and x-rage:awsum:

i think this would be a pretty nice build.

Well, that's what i got in my ata, except that i wont boost xrage until i get vengeance to 5 minimum. But i guess everyone can test that before i do, with the boosted exp running everywhere except in midranda it will take me looong time to get the necessary EPs and i don't feel like playing my ata in awell, she is very poorly equiped :(

But yes, it can be a very nice (or at least fun to play) build.

SelenisAaargh
February 15th, 2010, 01:31 PM
Just keep in mind that at 8 split delay does a noticeable jump.
Its so bad im considering to resett my skills to get farina to 5 just to have a speed 10 spamm attack stacking with forces and frost damage ^^
Your build sounds interesting and youre right, as long you have fun who cares :)
This is the case for all who play ata, we could just give up and play FS/Pike/Powermech :p if we played this game for powerplay.

Baaly
February 17th, 2010, 11:08 AM
Baaly, and some others (the minority) have some experience with this build. I also feel it would be effective, as you can greatly decrease the speed of ANY monster you attack.

well... actually i gave up on frost-jav at lvl 98 and put the points all into vengeance now.

the reason is that after iron2 i didnt realy see the effect anymore on the mobs.
and i found it rather useless using it in ice1, ice2 & cave.
i mean VS all those ice mobs there? im surprised frost-jav doesnt have a healing effect on them . HaHaHa

i just thought: what the heck - just wait till loc (lvl95). but visualy no effect to be seen there either.
is it a bug or something?

Chislev
February 18th, 2010, 12:31 PM
Hahaha don't mention that, baal, or they will make it heal the monsters for sure, just to mess with atas a little bit more. I can understand why it doesn't add damage vs ice mobs, i can accept it not dealing extra damage to undeads (in most RPG engines undeads are basically impervious to cold damage) but the other mobs in the islands... they are neither ice creatures nor undead, though it has no effect on them anyways... blah, it sucks,

Viseris
February 19th, 2010, 10:15 AM
Ok guys, here's my secret build I favor now with countless experimentation on my part. I don't want it to be a secret, because I may be quitting PT, depending on whether or not the girl I desire will go out with me :XD:

Akitia 85 Ata by the way, if you've seen me around, Valento Server.

Here's my build:

10 Tov
10 Throwing
10 Split Jav
1 Lightning Jav
1 Twisted Jav
4 Soul Sucker
1 Windy
1 Storm Javelin

2 Hov
10 X-Rage
1 Frost javelin

By Level 90 Hov would be level 5
Soul Sucker 5 Atleast
WIndy 2-3

You may ask what about storm? I just don't use it, and with a lack of Vengenance, I have no SP to put there. X-Rage does good damage, hitting an unlimited number of mobs, with ALMOST the range/area of DL at level 10. Its takes some skill to use with its delay.

What works best for me is going for a tanker-ata build because I don't have ubar 1on1 dmg from vengenance. I try to tank all mobs and aoe them to death gradually while tanking, since X-Rage hits all mobs in a 360 radius around me.

At level 85 I have 515hp, (+60 from Dev gear) and was planning to put all point until 90 into health. Which would leave me close to 650 hp (with quest hp) at level 90. I also use soulsucker, to save HP Pots, do some slight area damage, since I'm tanking. When you think about it, its almost like a reverse agony with a delay. So I like it. I believe Ata's can be the second best tankers in the game, but hardly any at all go for an HP Build.

Tell me what you guys think of this build.

Baaly
February 19th, 2010, 12:41 PM
omg soul-sucker lvl4

u should have kept ur build secret ;)

Nnoitra
February 22nd, 2010, 04:30 AM
Does Soul Sucker work?

Chislev
February 22nd, 2010, 09:44 AM
It does work, but not good enough, it has way too many "requirements"... and it wont work at the end levels (undeads).

I like the overall about that build, except for the soul sucker part.

SelenisAaargh
February 22nd, 2010, 02:24 PM
Yea, I may be convinced investing 9 EP into Xrage and leaving Storm out is ok for a party build but Soulsucker is a dealbreaker.
With your high health you should have no problems with weightlimit, so why not using healthpots? o.0

Also as im 91 now and started to hunt in Icecave... You WILL cry for Vengeance there... im basicly spamming constantly Vengence there to even have a reasonable killtime....

Oh and maybe you are fine tanking without HoV up to s2 but in i1 and i2 a tanking ATA DOES need HoV.
You guys can say what you want. This Evade is good for you and your party members.

About your consideration of ata as second best tanker...
Second best to whom?

Fighters are natural tanks with their high HP and Absorb and def just from their plain straightforward build.
Pikes can be good tanker just because they basicly have to also because of their high hp.
Mechs have to invest some into health but if they do they can outtank fighters.
Priestesses can be better tanks than Pikes or Mechs with their 1000+ hp from healthbuild and their reasonable high absorb and def from 80d aged equip.
Knights are better tanks if they stick to shield+onehanded sword.
Mages can become great tanks just because of ES.

We basicly outtank all archerbuilds but so does every other build out there.

They all are better at tanking if they want this position. HoV and shieldstrike are our only defensive skills. Im not saying Ata is a bad tank but second best ingame... no way. We can be a reliable tank lets leave it at that.

Viseris
February 23rd, 2010, 06:31 AM
Hmm. Thanks for the input guys. I know yall have had way more experience with Ata than myself. Constructive criticism is good :awsum:

Ok so Ima reskill, since Soul Sucker is too iffy in the higher maps, and I'll need Windy more so I don't miss. But my reasoning behind X-Rage is this. If you're a great tank...its doesn't matter as much if you don't have a good aoe, because you'll just be doing party support and killing monsters 1on1.

With Tanking, and going for a tank ata build, you'll be able to tank on (with my subpar gear I was able to hold off grotesque, and like 6-7 other i1 mobs just shy off 500 HP (took off my d-gem shield for a +8). This is what I'd do. I just 1on1 melee attack the grotesque and I wouldn't even touch the other mobs except with x-rage. They would die slowly with X-rage because of its 360s degree radius. That's what I meant by the applications with tanking and x-rage. If I go high agil/low HP and high vengeance, I lean towards 1on1ing mobs and a more "hit and run" playstyle. That's the point I wanted to get across. During this test, I only had about 77 abs (still aging Wvy armor and shield, that's why I was in i1 to begin with) an 25 block. So I think this way of killing mobs works for me, and is way less boring than 1on1 everything. Hmm did I mention I was adding all point toward 90 into HP, plus the +40 from 90 quest. So that's close to 650 hp, even after I take off all my D-gem gear.

WIndy will be 8 for me and Level 90 and Soul Sucker 1. Thanks for input everyone.

Baaly
February 23rd, 2010, 11:17 AM
errrr..... u rly dont need to lvl windy.

u get high atk-rating anyways from AGI.

i have windy 3 now but only becuz i just put the rest of my points there...

SelenisAaargh
February 23rd, 2010, 11:47 AM
I believe that you are and will be able to tank well, I didnt question that :)
I know how I can tank when my hp raise to 600 with VL.
Just not that superiour as you assesed but still well IMHO.

Baalys thought about windy is also true.
I hit all mobs till kelvlair very well, infact I dont see any difference to normal chance of miss you get anyway.
The only real advance from windy would be the raised range and duration which can be nice I agree.

Maybe you could try Farina? at 5 Farina gives a speed boost of 2 and it chains with frost jav :)
Since youre resetting skills anyway, just some food for thought.

Viseris
February 23rd, 2010, 03:01 PM
errrr..... u rly dont need to lvl windy.

u get high atk-rating anyways from AGI.



Hmm well for me my agility is only 160 atm :XD: So I only have about 1150 atr without windy and about 1250 with windy lvl 5. With the build I am on, I question whether I will even raise agility too far above 200, because I want health as high as I need to be able to tank MULTIPLE ice mobs etc. Since my goal will be to aoe the things around me whenever the delay runs out, the mobs around me when gradually lose their hp while I take down the thing that hits the hardest. Essentially, the more I can tank, the more damage I do.

SelenisAaargh
February 23rd, 2010, 05:08 PM
That would require lots and lots of HP, ice mobs hit HARD.
No comparison to i1 or i2 mobs.
Most of them also keep you frozen.

and as soon a devilbird or chaos cara appears youre in trouble. take me more than a minute to take a db down with constant ven spam...
but you should make your own experiences and you can always change builds anyway :)

Baaly
February 23rd, 2010, 05:39 PM
I want health as high as I need to be able to tank MULTIPLE ice mobs etc.


wrong class - make a mech :p

Viseris
February 23rd, 2010, 06:46 PM
lol guys :XD: You know why Ata's can't tank. They have less than 500 hp at 9x with base health! Don't underestimate 50%+ combined evade/block ratios compared with high hp and the ability to have a shield up 100%. My view is this: we have a shield...why not tank?

Are Ata's the best 1on1ers in the game. No. Our damage is not good (compared to fs,ps, and archers).

Low Hp Build Gives you this:
-7th best Tanker in the game or 2nd worst depending on how u wanna look at it (according to Selenis)
-Decent Party support with Tov and Hov (Yes thats a given on 100% of ata)
- Best 1on1 damage. No. Who outdamages us? Pike. Fighter. Archer. Maybe even Knights idk. Atleast against undead they do where there are plenty in the higher maps. Maybe even a powermech will outdamage us, if you add in the dmg from magnetic sphere and golem, and the fact they carry 2 hander all the time.

High Hp Build Gives you this:
-2nd Best Tanker in the game imo: Why? What classes in the game go for an HP Build. Mech (sometimes but still not often) Mage. Priestess. Knights (sometimes but hardly at all still). Mage I'm not going to contend with in tanking abilities. Knights and Mechs still use 2 handers in battle the majority of the time, lowering their abs, and Pike 2 hander 99% of the time, same with FS. Ata uses a shield 100% of the time. So therefore, they take less dmg in the long run.
-I can laugh at you fellow ata when you get 1-shotted by a pike cs with your base hp (okay :awsum: haha...yeah I had to throw that in)
-Take on more mobs at once 1on1 the strongest mob and aoe the rest, so that you are not killing 1 mob at a time, but 5-6.
-Damage is still decent, not compared with base hp Atas veng 10 ata's but hey...I aoe, you 1on1 the stuff that hits me the hardest while I tank for you. There we go.

Btw my veng is now 1 Selenis so let's clear that misconception. I use Split 10 Veng 1 and X-rage 10 all in a 1on1 situation.

For the record I can use 1 split 1 X-rage and 5 veng's per mana bar.

SelenisAaargh
February 24th, 2010, 06:21 AM
okok lol

just one thing... you need 1000+ hp not to be 1shoted by a 9x pike cs (if he hits you)

Chislev
February 24th, 2010, 10:52 AM
Well, it can't be called HP build if she doesn't have over 1000 hp at 9x ;)

I agree with the overall idea, it is (with some obvious differences) very much the kind of build i use on my main ata as well, just that mine is a mixed str/hp build.

I am BC's worse enemy (i honestly despise that map) but i must give it that i would really really love to see the actual face of a pike player when try to 1 hit my ata and failing on the attempt lmao I bet the first words to come out from his/her mouth (i doubt any lady actually play pikes) will be "cheater!" rofl

I agree about being not necessary to raise windy. Even though atas don't have the benefit that all other classes has at high level because javelins are the only standard weapon without AR bonus, (the other one are hammers which no one use) i can tell you that even my absolutelly non-agi ata rarely miss a hit, the only truly nice aspect on windy is the added range for luring purposes. Once i had all my SP skills maxed where i wanted (tm10, tov10) i had to decide what to do with the remaining points so i wanted to have some fun, and i am raising bigger spear hehe as a str/hp atalanta it is very fun to mess around with a scythe, besides they look way sexier in atas than pikes :p :p :p (well, everything look sexier on atas after all) It is also a nice way to remember how were the old days before having tier2 skills

TotesHuhn
February 26th, 2010, 03:44 PM
mmhh whats to point to tank with a ranged character? @ the guy who wants to tank in ice

Chislev
February 26th, 2010, 06:11 PM
Whats the point of not doing so?

SelenisAaargh
February 26th, 2010, 06:24 PM
mmhh whats to point to tank with a ranged character? @ the guy who wants to tank in ice

Lately ive been training with an archer or a prs in i1 hs and there I do tank.
Because its needed and I can.

However Icemaps are totally another level of damage... especially cave.

ed teh gar
February 26th, 2010, 09:28 PM
High Hp Build Gives you this:
-2nd Best Tanker in the game imo: Why? What classes in the game go for an HP Build. Mech (sometimes but still not often) Mage. Priestess. Knights (sometimes but hardly at all still). Mage I'm not going to contend with in tanking abilities. Knights and Mechs still use 2 handers in battle the majority of the time, lowering their abs, and Pike 2 hander 99% of the time, same with FS. Ata uses a shield 100% of the time. So therefore, they take less dmg in the long run.
-I can laugh at you fellow ata when you get 1-shotted by a pike cs with your base hp (okay :awsum: haha...yeah I had to throw that in)
-Take on more mobs at once 1on1 the strongest mob and aoe the rest, so that you are not killing 1 mob at a time, but 5-6.
-Damage is still decent, not compared with base hp Atas veng 10 ata's but hey...I aoe, you 1on1 the stuff that hits me the hardest while I tank for you. There we go.

hmm.

Dont forget Knights and Mechs have skills that add block even with spear/sword out.
Es 10 adds 11% blk onto a spears already 1x block. Dont forget Comp adds 23 abs also. Also a mage cannot be killed if they dont want to be. On a mage i have tanked a few 10x at once til a few others joined and i got raped. Also a pike using a shield + pole + vague 10 is almost untouchable. 30% block from shield + 15% from wdm with pole and 23% vague is a lot to get through.


Btw what server do you play? im guessing you dont play valento or midranda as any 9x + pike is doin at least 5xx damage with dev force. Vanish + cs will go through that hp pretty easily. A pike with 850 hp at lv 100 will still die to other pikes cs so i dunno.

Honestly atas have always fascinated me. they seem to have interesting niches.

ReyJunZ
February 26th, 2010, 09:54 PM
. 30% block from shield + 15% from wdm with pole and 23% vague is a lot to get through.

i guess the wdm is only compatible with TWO HANDED weps,
try use only pole without shield and get hit by mobs.. i dont see block from my char

ed teh gar
February 26th, 2010, 10:16 PM
i guess the wdm is only compatible with TWO HANDED weps,
try use only pole without shield and get hit by mobs.. i dont see block from my char

you mean like this? Cause i do.
http://img194.imageshack.us/img194/2227/2010226202014.jpg

This is ept.

ReyJunZ
March 5th, 2010, 07:15 PM
oh yeah.. i tried it also.. pole can block, pike is really IMBA

Viseris
April 25th, 2010, 07:49 AM
Guys for the record you probably know who I am :P

Yes, Akitia is my 8x ata on Valento.

At lvl 86 I had, 716 hp with a +40 shield +20 Jav and VL 10. Ohx probably knows, yeah I got owned, but that's only because I went after a 10x pike, even he didn't 1 shot me.

Even though I don't bc much anymore, Ezme and some other probably know the skills/stats of my ata, and will carry on in my place. So best of luck:awsum:

Oh yes. My veng is 5 so I do utilize it now.

I cannot figure out these formatting tags ahh!

vleeskees
April 25th, 2010, 10:51 AM
okay so i didnt read all...cus its way too much text :P
but ive had a build with 10 twist jav and 10 frost....
believe me...twist SUCKS....its only 1 shot...so it will never compete with vengeance even 1 single bit...and frost....reallly why would u even normal hit when ur grinding seriously..
only in low lvl maps and in s1 party i use normal hits..but later when you really need the best exp you can get you will spam the best skills possible

also ive been low str build.. wearing 80D shield and supreme armor
well....i hated it..maybe its just becus im lazy..but really dieing in s2 on 9x? cmon...
hit n run just sux :P respect for those archers who can do it but hit n run is really such a lame thing to do

as an ata you already wear a shield, so why not just make use of the tanking ability you get

and im not sure about this but is x rage really 3 hitd of 160% dmg boost? thats bull...if thats the case u should be able to 1 hit ppl easily, but thats obviously not the case

i dont know what skills were changed/boosted since that last change of skills..but vengeance is an awsome skill, i think you should make use of it

Chislev
April 25th, 2010, 11:45 AM
Well.... now that the second shot from vengeance really likes to miss a lot, maybe some of the older skills could do better damage at the end. Before the path the 2nd hit fro mvengeance never missed, so you had actually double damage output, but now the equation has changed and not precisely to favor our atas.

7dustie7
April 25th, 2010, 01:05 PM
Well.... now that the second shot from vengeance really likes to miss a lot, maybe some of the older skills could do better damage at the end. Before the path the 2nd hit fro mvengeance never missed, so you had actually double damage output, but now the equation has changed and not precisely to favor our atas.

:confused:
my observation is exactly the opposite, sry.
what about the 4x% critrate with a high aged spike jav?
all i see is ven kills alot faster now. also its way cheaper on mana now.

ive went through many build, statwise and skill wise and in the end its like this:

if youre 9x you build has to contain 80d armor (or at least +10 sala), windy 10 and either hov 10 rest vengeance for support build, or vengeance 10 and hov rest for solo hunt/train build.

everything else is bull, sry. ive invested 30k+ sp for reskills / restats to get here but i am now.

Viseris
April 25th, 2010, 02:46 PM
Guys, like think out of the box please! :XD:

Ok here is my ata at 86. Tier 4 Skills.

Hov 4
Frost 4
X-rage 1
Veng 5

If I went to 10x I would probably. Anyone's choice from here. Personally, from a clan stand point, or anything really, it'd be a waste to have multiple ata's with hov 10, an hp buffer would allow you some versatility with your build, say if you wanna to xping longer without mana usage or something.

X-Rage and Frost are my grind (xping, up to i2) skills. I don't even use mana really cause it is a waste. I take no damage anyways. Storm lvl 1 sucks and is a mana hog. Other classes can aoe better, I don't really know why so many other ata's are so reliant on this skill to be honest.

You are underestimating the damage %mod on x-rage. It is almost like, a destroyer from fs but aoe! Except it obviously does less because well for one, not many ata's even raise this skill! It is good stuff. 360 degree aoe, 1on1 when its up.

For 1on1, I usually do split when its up, veng to x-rage to veng to split to veng to repeating that combo! :XD: We need some versatility here guys. There is more than 1 cookie cutter ata build trust me.

vleeskees
April 25th, 2010, 03:28 PM
really...in pt you will soon enough find out that solo is the best exp..
so storm javelin is a very good use here...also its of very good use in sod..
and in i2 fighting without mana? forget it, mana pots arent there for nothing
and an aoe skill with such long delay sucks, it might be better to spam a 1 v 1 skill, ull prolly kill more and faster then 1 aoe attack,
when u party frost javelin might be okay, but it will still take you alot time to kill

i dont know how fast you get your exp but i dont think its fast..

7dustie7
April 25th, 2010, 04:42 PM
Guys, like think out of the box please! :XD:

Ok here is my ata at 86. Tier 4 Skills.

Hov 4
Frost 4
X-rage 1
Veng 5

If I went to 10x I would probably. Anyone's choice from here. Personally, from a clan stand point, or anything really, it'd be a waste to have multiple ata's with hov 10, an hp buffer would allow you some versatility with your build, say if you wanna to xping longer without mana usage or something.

X-Rage and Frost are my grind (xping, up to i2) skills. I don't even use mana really cause it is a waste. I take no damage anyways. Storm lvl 1 sucks and is a mana hog. Other classes can aoe better, I don't really know why so many other ata's are so reliant on this skill to be honest.

You are underestimating the damage %mod on x-rage. It is almost like, a destroyer from fs but aoe! Except it obviously does less because well for one, not many ata's even raise this skill! It is good stuff. 360 degree aoe, 1on1 when its up.

For 1on1, I usually do split when its up, veng to x-rage to veng to split to veng to repeating that combo! :XD: We need some versatility here guys. There is more than 1 cookie cutter ata build trust me.

just try reskilling and ven 10 only once :P
youll see the point
best way is to use at least devine force and mana recharge!
frost is pointless in 9x and up maps, sad but true
frost 1 is already nice enough in BC

trust me try ven 10 once and all discussions will cease

Viseris
April 25th, 2010, 06:03 PM
Your point lol? There is more than 1 build. I say I can go without mana and keep going. You probably veng 10 me in bc, I evade, probably slow you down more than me since my frost jav is higher, and then , you cannot move.

Yes hunting atas are decent, don't get me wrong. But still, you will probably be dead with a split jav 10 to veng 5 to x-rage 5 combo. Thank you.


Since I am throwing out 8 attacks in the span of like 3 seconds

Also I tank s2 naked!

7dustie7
April 25th, 2010, 09:41 PM
Your point lol? There is more than 1 build. I say I can go without mana and keep going. You probably veng 10 me in bc, I evade, probably slow you down more than me since my frost jav is higher, and then , you cannot move.

Yes hunting atas are decent, don't get me wrong. But still, you will probably be dead with a split jav 10 to veng 5 to x-rage 5 combo. Thank you.


Since I am throwing out 8 attacks in the span of like 3 seconds

Also I tank s2 naked!

rofl riiight
cant move etc.
keep dreaming
ven 5 doesnt do ****, split 10 maybe but i have hov 7 too? and split doesnt have vens crit
x-rage? cmon are you serious? forces dont work with x-rage! its useless in pvp!
i go into pvp with enigmaforce FYI as do all others
and who uses s2 as argument??

i can tank i2 hs, so what?
s2 is way too low xp so i dont even bother going there rofl

you have hov 4 so your defense is way down

dont know if you even pvped once in your life but you should learn something before throwing out BS like this:
a) how is damage resolved in pvp
b) atas dropp fast in pvp, its a question of hp
c) 3 seconds is a pretty long time in pvp, in 3 seconds you can use a pot more than 5 times
d) any skill which doesnt use forces is useless in BC

and with your hov 4 youre lunch i kill atas with those small stats one after another, usually i need 1.5 vens

and oh youre the one with hp build?
then excuse me but your base damage is more of a tickle and all your grand schemes with skills wont do anything!
dont believe me?
go into bc and have some testfights before open your mouth

look i get it you went into this without much thought and found a way to have fun with your skills OK
but clearly you did not test out other skill configurations and you try to sell this as *thinking out of the box*

as i said earlier, i spent 30k+ subapoints on reset of skills and stats, i know what im talking about, you dont have to talk smack here, not before you collected some real experiences.

Viseris
April 26th, 2010, 08:28 AM
Lol. Please. I moved a 10x Fs hp with veng 5 not even using any type of force. 716 hp with vl 10 at 86. Nothing can 1 shot me. Oh and in a Pvp situation, I would get a hov 10 from some other ata clannie who had this, thank you.


I win. Give up.

Bump: Talk to ohxrebirth or exodus you nub, then get back to me.

Some one calculate.

Veng 5------------2 shots at a 50% dmg modifier +10 crit factored in and whatever force

X-Rage 5-----------3 shots with a 110% dmg modifier non force damage but hitting all in the area, probably stunning them with this damage output.

Split level 2 up to 10-----3 shots in a very quick succession, probably used as the finishing move after veng has lowered their hp enough. Split with its attack rating boost at the higher levels would actually hit more often than veng!

Stop being noobs atas. Or I don't really care.

7dustie7
April 26th, 2010, 09:09 AM
just try it and stop calculating lmao

how long are you playing PT?

you havent learned yet that most skills look only nice on paper?

you want to stun a 9x pike or fs with your lil xrage jump?

are you kidding?

and just the fact you mentioned *probably* only says you didnt even try your build in PVP

so whos the loud mouth n00b here?

how much xp do you make in 5x event?

you can beat 150kk/hour?
i think not

you made this thread months ago and youre still 8x

i made in this time arund 10 bill xp

just a little food for thought lil ata

also im coparing ven 10 to your measle rage 5 and ven 5

ven 10: 100% damg boost 25% crit rate with +80 on min and max damage and +10% base damage from force
you want to compare this to a lil jump you make every 7 seconds?
jeez

dont worry "dont play according to the fools folly" and i wont argue with you :p
just stay 8x till 2012, ill even come to your server and make a 100 ata from scratch before you reach 95

vleeskees
April 26th, 2010, 09:20 AM
besides...its pretty lame to count in ANOTHER chars buff....
i could also say i got 10 fon 10 hov and 10 vl from someone besides my own buffs >.>
ofcourse id be strong...
nyway tanking s2 is nothing special, ur supposed to be able to do that
i agree with dustie here

7dustie7
April 26th, 2010, 09:28 AM
Lol. Please. I moved a 10x Fs hp with veng 5 not even using any type of force. 716 hp with vl 10 at 86. Nothing can 1 shot me. Oh and in a Pvp situation, I would get a hov 10 from some other ata clannie who had this, thank you.


FYI With VL nothing can 1 shot me either but thats because VL is also way more than just hp add, but since you dont understand this yet i wont fill your head with more infos.
Last BC i tanked 2 9x pikes both csing me, i could do that because i had VL.
Without VL im lunch if all attacks hit. oh and i dont have 3 seconds for 8 attacks either, its half a second and its done.

The point is a 9x fs or pike has only to sneeze and youre on your back without vl.
With VL even a base health ata still stands.

And with xrage you can flinch a 10x fs once ok... but what then?
he comes at you and youre on your back just as well.

I have such a skill to, its called "lvl 1 Shield Strike" and hey! i can even spam that! imagine that.

*sigh*

Chislev
April 26th, 2010, 11:50 AM
Wasn't this htread about PVE? When did it turn into retard PVP trolling "because-your-build-suck-amd-you-are-such-an-idiot-because-you-dont-do-as-i-say"?

Lucky for us, there are many many builds out there already available and many more yet to be discover, so instead of attacking osmeone trying something different should show some respect for those not using the same dumb "wiki builds".

As it is really obvious, not everyone read this thread from its start, and that was pretty well stated that it is not about who get most exp per hour or how many shots it iakes to kill this or thatr, neither if can stand one shot (good luck trying to survive ONE hit from a 119 pike lmao, impossible unless you have above 1k HP,funny how people talk and talk and don't even know what happen when you meet the real high levels).

7dustie7
April 26th, 2010, 04:23 PM
If you follow the developement closely youll see that the threadstarter himself brought this element into the *discussion* because someone dared to question the effectiveness of his build.

also when you talk about PvE the discussion is exactly about that, *how much xp can you get per hour*

you could ofcourse just as well max out bigges spear and be a scythe ata
it would be even fun till youre 6x

but dont come here and call it a *build*

what he has is a collection of skills he likes to use and he doesnt care that he cant really kill all that well.
its his right to do that, but if he starts to talk smack about some delusional effectiveness, then he should expect some reactions.

also Chislev, you should look more closely into what VL really does, not only what the skill description says.
just ask some of the more observant high lvl prses or party with one in LoC.
The difference in the performance is NOT only due to 150 to 200 more hp...
a dark guard or dark phalanx can do up to 400 damage to me without vl, when i lure 2 dark guards im lunch.
with lvl 10 vl i can tank 3 mobs there easily. thats not only because of 180 hp more.

Chislev
April 26th, 2010, 05:17 PM
As long as the originator has somekind of planning on how to develop stats and skills, it is an actual build. If it is the like of other people or not, it's a different and insignificant story.

About VL, first is has nothing to do within the atalanta section, second i don't play piestesses nor play with them either (not many to play with in my server even if i want to) so i don't know if that can be truth or just an impression.

PVE means enjoy the game, it is deffinitely not about how many exp per hur can u do (man... if i ever consider a game like that i would jump off a cliff) it is about how do you enjoy the game, and for many people enjoying the game is not just how fast you level up while you miss all the fun of the areas you run through.

Oh, the scythe.... I would say the fun starts after 6x, not that it would end by then.

Viseris
April 26th, 2010, 09:40 PM
How much time you spend mana farming haha...I could be xping when u sit in ricarten because u need 250 mana pots each grind. I still use mana pots just I conserve myself thank you.


Directed at 7dus whatever your name is: You are the one being naive and ignorant. Not myself. Do as you please. I do it better. I actually have a life, trying to create my own clan and raise it from the ground up. PT is but a mere past time for me, and I never take it seriously. But still, you are too close minded to believe anything I say...so whatever.

I also spend ton of time just socializing in navisko if you have seen me "Probably". I have graduated from taking this game seriously thank you. I level at my own pace, do things my own way, just like in real life.

Stop being an elitist. I don't like those people IRL or otherwise.

Also to Chislev: The build on my ata would probably have....1000 hp BASE by level 10x with a idk...150 to 200 health stat. I think I can tank anyone's hit in the game, that is if they can reach me being slowed down :P

Also to all: Stop being nubs: VL 10 takes and boosts 30% of whatever your current hp is at the time of casting. That is how I can get 716 hp (+40 D-gem shield +20 jav) though I perfer block on my shield to buffer my lack of high lvl HOV.

You tank better because your hp is greater, that means as hits keep coming, you still have the same proportion of evade defense and block, except your life bar is extended therefore, over the long term your life bar goes down slower because you can buffer the hits easier as they come. This isn't rocket science. I know its hard to bow to some seemingly random stranger such as myself. But I really don't care do whatever. I will probably pwn you and not even try doing so. At level 86.

7dustie7
April 27th, 2010, 12:47 AM
1st. im always at least under mana down or mana recharge

2nd. youre wrong about VL only giving the hp

3rd. with a mixed jav and your low agi you wont be even able to overcome my absorb

but its no point to argue with you, i just stated some facts youll learn to be true later (or not)

just a little fun fact:

when i go into pvp my base damage is 400-550 with enigma force
when i hunt its 350 -500ish with cele force
i have 87 absorb, 1600 defense

i want to see you even tickle me a little with your mixed jav

vleeskees
April 27th, 2010, 09:02 AM
socializing? starting a clan is not taking it serious? writing PAGEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSS of texts about your build and other builds, is not taking it serious?
really now?
maybe you should just face it, you play a game cus u like to, its okay to take it a little serious
besides if this is YOUR way, why are you so determined to convince others instead of just lettin it slide

and using mana is a CHOISEEEEE for EVERY character, any or every build can choose wether they use mana or not, but its obvious ur exp will go down =]

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 11:27 AM
Napys u nub. Ask Flower power. I cannot tank a 9x's pike vanish to cs YET I need like 900 hp ! I have 551 hp with +60 from my jav and shield.

Also dust stop being a nub. I have veng 5 and do plenty of dmg with enigma ty. Please 1on1 bc doesn't mean ....anything guys. Stop being naive for the love of.

When I would actually go to like take bc seriously and not like an idiot, I would have clan support so I don't get like 10 vs 1 where I have to tank some 10x fs destroyer and a vanish cs combo at the same time or some crazy junk.

In that situation I would have over 1000 hp with VL, hov level 10 from my clannie ata. And then I would be freezing anyone arse who stood in my way, and let the pikes knights (devine piercing) and fighters pwn all in 3 hits, or 7. That is not my job as ata.

As Ata and my build I:

1)Tank everything even in i2. With 80abs mind you. I don't move. Ever.

2) When people cry about not having enough mana in SOD cause I use 0 mana ever, just like my frost 10 ata buddy. Though I have frost 4 mind u. I just keep going.

3) I can like probably 3 hit/shot ko 40 mobs aoe if my X-rage was a higher level, but its only level 1 Thank you.

Bump: Also guys...I have a hotter girl friend than u IRL....I WIN....




P.S. Ladies: I know its not all about the looks. My girl just has everything I am looking for. Napsys I am your elder irl dude. Please come back to me when u are like 18 or even 21. That's why I bow down to Sas from Synergy, he's my elder, and more experienced with life. I don't know everything.

But I sure in heck know more than people younger than me. Thank you.

7dustie7
April 27th, 2010, 12:03 PM
youre actually quite the burden for your clan in BC

since 3 month im always in the clan holding BC on my server and im there 90% of the time.

a lvl86 wouldnt even be allowed to run around on ground in my clan because youre just a burden and easy DP for the enemy
yopu dont give any buffs, you use up prses vl time AND you dont do any damage

how serious is that for you?

you like to call other nubs? all your reasoning only show that you never once were in an actual serious attack on BC, all you maybe did was goofing ard with your buddies.

you barely reached i2! and you want to argue with us? ROFLMAO

The reality in BC is this:
high lvl prs are rare so they all are surrounded by clannies who want VL
you as ata are supposed to give what you are there for, meaning HOV

nobody ever uses aoe crap in BC! stop this nonsese youre making a fool out of yourself!


my point is:

ask one 94-96 ata with windy 10 and ven 10 to fight you in bc
just for once actually test something and dont be all smacktalk
but i doubt you would fess up to how the fight went in here anyway

just do it for the fun ofit

and stop this nonsense with depending on the help of others you loudmouth little brat!

get some xp for a change and STFU till youre 9x

Chislev
April 27th, 2010, 12:07 PM
Hey guys, guys, gals guys, whatever.... take a break! This is tstarting to look like my pupils teenagrs fights, no one is entirely right so it end talking about who has the hottest girlfriend?

I cannot use my IRL technique to end this fight (it involves a little use of brute strenght) but at least call to a time out.

This WAS a nce thread to read and share opinions until it started to be "i am more right than you nub" Why don't better make a step back, give some space for everyone and relax, let everyone play as they want, atalantas are so good and foolproof that no matter what build (or set of skills combo of stats) you do, she will still be reasonably good for something (prove of that is that we still see some agi atas around...) So let it be.

And please, talk about ATALANTAS skills/stats/builds, don't mix stuff with other classes skills/stats, they are not atalantas so they are not good enough to be here http://www.robmdq.com.ar/robtoons/mockery3.gif

Hern, my comment on health wasnt AGAINST you lol, don't jump at my neck (don't make me use my elderness hehe)

Now that, joking i talked about elderness... Age here really don't have much to do, many PT players could easily be my grand childs, but that wont make anybody show more respect, on the contrary, it will ring many bells on teenagers mentality and would become the target of a lot of perfectly fine demonstrations of why should have told them that you were older ;)

Uhm... socializing in navisko, so that's why i saw so many people there the other day when i logged my mule in valento? I remember the good old chats and socializing times that used to take place by the fire in Ruinen's encampment, nowadays no one ever goes there anymore.

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 12:12 PM
Chislev: I am not the immature one here. I love my ata as it is, and I respect all builds, even frost 10 ones. I like it.

Some people are just too closeminded here. They cannot accept defeat or even...acknowledgement. Pathetic really.

7dustie7
April 27th, 2010, 12:17 PM
oh and FYI since you havent left 8x since the last 4 months:

in kelv lair and higher youll never fight more than one mob at once, even mechs run from certain lures in LOC

you really have no idea how pt developes and all you do is talk BS about elders and stuff.

Bump:
Chislev: I am not the immature one here. I love my ata as it is, and I respect all builds, even frost 10 ones. I like it.

Some people are just too closeminded here. They cannot accept defeat or even...acknowledgement. Pathetic really.

you havent reacted to one single of my comments?

i wonder who is defeated here...

Bump: @ Chislev how can i discuss with him, explain that to me?
i said already that i tested numerous builds.
yes even x-rage 10... its CRAP compared to my current build
period!
in s2 its ok from time to time but honestly with hov and ven youre way faster.
and in cave and LOC xrage and frost jave are rightout useless.
im not happy about this, frost jav has nice potential if 100+ mobs werent immune to it.

i said it right out without smothering his cute lil experiment and he started talking smack.

all he does is talking about hypotheticals mixed with some nice lies.
he wont consider testing other builds (either cos he cant afford the itemshop items or cos hes too dumb)
and he wont react to arguments of others

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 12:30 PM
you havent reacted to one single of my comments?

i wonder who is defeated here...


Because doing so would be a waste of my time.

7dustie7
April 27th, 2010, 12:38 PM
never a waste of time to consider reason and start thinking
even if its maybe for the first time in your life.

i know its hard with all your hormones swelling up.

been there done that.

vleeskees
April 27th, 2010, 01:03 PM
really dude, what has my age got to do it with it? for real? judging my comments + actual arguments cus you feel older? girlfriend in real life wow ur so cool now man ur 20+ year and u finaly got ur first girlfriend, good for you, its not like im putting my whole relationlife on here
and besides, u can not call other ''clannies'' their buff into a discussion thats about a build of 1 character...thats just simply cheating...

dustie has simply way better arguments...
really dude
0 mana in sod? u wont kill sh*t after room 4
so if you wanna show good and bad points about a build leave other skills and classes out of the discussion like chris said, and also leave real life out of this too, it has nothing to do with ur ata.
and yea....get 9x man..

enough said ;)

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 01:28 PM
Napsys. I only burn mana when my teammates are killing too slow or I have to like beat another team. I am bloating with my claims of no mana usage. Like. Think for a minute seriously.

Also Napsys last time I check you were 85 dude.

You could be 9x by now. But please PT is not high on my list of priorities. I am self-employed and that is the only reason I have time to waste my time like this, more than most. Only because I enjoy this game and its community.

Bump: You idiots. I could pick up any woman in existence. But I am happily taken thank you.

vleeskees
April 27th, 2010, 01:47 PM
2.3% till 94 thank you ;), some ppl DO use their time,
oh and my ata is 92 =],
get ur facts right =D

i need to think for a sec?
sod is burning mana al lthe way
cus u wont outkill that mother of all hs

btw, u talk pretty much b/s for a 'mature' elder...

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 02:02 PM
Ok Napsys sorry dude. I don't have like 18 hours a day to play PT. I am my own website dev. clan leader of two clans from 2 diff games, and I am also starting my own client business.

I enjoy PT and have since it has opened in 2001, when you were probably in diapers. Ok that's an exaggeration :P Though I have my fun. If you haven't noticed I am like very sarcastic, humorous, and I joke around alot. It's how I am today. I never use to be this confident. Its an acquired confidence. Trust me.

vleeskees
April 27th, 2010, 02:09 PM
i have school, like every ''kid'' and im also clan leader...maybe i have more time then you,
but thats out of this discussion, im not randomly spamming chats talking to myself or talking to GMs who arent even reading it..
train more to really show some results from ur build

oh, and ive played pt long enough to know something about it

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 03:33 PM
Restat:

Hov: 5 ---> 7 90

X-rage 4

Frost: 5

Chislev
April 27th, 2010, 03:44 PM
***removes this thread from the subscribed list and let it rotten in the past***

Honestly guys, this turned into pointless ranting.

What i see the most here is a lack of tolerace.

Just be a bit more tolerant with whos trying his own idea of a new build, if it is so terrible bad he will realize it when the proper time comes and will have to either restat or make a new character, not the end of the world. (Still, there are nicer ways of talking and saying exactly what you have said, dustie)

On the other side, sometimes we have to listen what people want to tell us, even if it means having to raise a firewall and a double filter to read between rather rude comments, and take it as it is. OF course, when someone try to "teach" us instead of give us an advice or suggestion it can be hard, but well, nobody is perfect (but myself of ourse) :p

I don't think anybody here wanted to be mean or do any bad, just let it be. Dustie can be in peace with his conscience since already told how bad Hern's idea could be, Hern can keep on his experimenting and maybe someday will say "i was right" or may say "i was wrong", only time can tell.

On the girlfriends stuff, guys, that can be settled only with a knock down, and that is achieved by deed and not by words. I am widow so i'm out of the discussion, but if you don't mind guys, i can set up a ring and make some extra cash selling tickets for the show :) (and of course the "under the table" usual gambling)

Let's all be happy.

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 03:45 PM
Chislev: My ata friend uses frost 10 and owns with it. Thank you.

My 8x ata buddy from Phatclan for the nonbelievers. He even uses Farina as a 1on1 since the damage and speed boost actually stack with that skill. Something I would go for if I actually wanted frost 10. Frost 5 is ok for me. On second thought, I might get my farina to 5 to make up for my lack of veng. People will be suprised, with 1 hit and 10 speed how fast u can recover from attacks.

Chislev
April 27th, 2010, 05:03 PM
Chislev: My ata friend uses frost 10 and owns with it. Thank you.

My 8x ata buddy from Phatclan for the nonbelievers. He even uses Farina as a 1on1 since the damage and speed boost actually stack with that skill. Something I would go for if I actually wanted frost 10. Frost 5 is ok for me. On second thought, I might get my farina to 5 to make up for my lack of veng. People will be suprised, with 1 hit and 10 speed how fast u can recover from attacks.

Uhm, i didn't said anything about frost, i am not a fan of that skill, specially because it get useless in the end game (and i don't play pvp). maybe IF frost would stack with other skills it would be more attractive to me, for example usig farina + frost would be a blast, but as it is now, it becomes useless as early as you get to ice map (except for the slow down, but i dn't hit and run so i don't need to slow down enemies) that's why i don't use it.

Something has changed lately though, since the patch HoV now has a decent duration, so i think i will raise it above 5 after i get veng 10 and xr 10 (i like that skill).

Farina is a nice option for when you already don't knw what more to raise with SPs, i would chose it without hesitation if i wasn't going for bigger spear myself (i like to fool around with scythes). What i am not certain is how good is the mana managing using farina, i mean, up to what level can it be raised and still be used without being a mana black hole, spamming a skill at 10 speed can be a very fast way to depleat your mana pot. I guess i will know when my mule reaches 8x.

Viseris
April 27th, 2010, 06:52 PM
According to my tests today with some people, I was doing more damage with frost jav melee attacks than my veng 5 at level 86. Spamming vengeance got me killed in bc, because of its animation. This among other things is the reason I have now dropped it forever.

vleeskees
April 28th, 2010, 01:54 AM
50% boost and 100% boost is a big difference
if you had 10 veng u might actualy kill someone
but thats just advice ofc, i dont have the perfect girlfriend and im young in rl, for those reasons my arguments are probably invalid

feel the sarcasm <3

Viseris
April 28th, 2010, 02:17 AM
Better watch what u say Napsys. Like when I get 90 it'll actually be a fair fight ty. Go pwn some 10x pike at 94 and 95. Can u do that. No you eat dirt in one vanish to cs. :awsum:

The only thing I want to really wanted to prove was that I could tank some 8x pike's vanish to cs combo at 551 hp. I did that. I am now happy.

vleeskees
April 28th, 2010, 08:56 AM
yea but im not stupid enough to challenge a 10x pike, first u challenge me, and afterwards you say its unfair, cmon man thats just sad,

Viseris
April 28th, 2010, 09:17 AM
K dude I'm not all-knowing. No hard feelings k?

Bump: Yeah, well guys keep in mind I do sacrifice some attack power by going for hp, that is obvious. However when I boost my hp, I can also tank a little bit better. The goal of bc is not to lone wulf everything but to work as a clan to achieve something, sod is the same way.

ulrikaxD
June 27th, 2010, 08:24 AM
a question... your build is ussefull for tank (easily) setos in lt? :XD:

btw... in et, ata alone dont need tank :XD:. tank mean possibility for die and lose xp :P. better lure and then hit. in this point, may be vengance start be a good skill :XD:

Viseris
June 27th, 2010, 01:53 PM
a question... your build is ussefull for tank (easily) setos in lt? :XD:

btw... in et, ata alone dont need tank :XD:. tank mean possibility for die and lose xp :P. better lure and then hit. in this point, may be vengance start be a good skill :XD:

Umm...its simply another style of build just like low str archers to high str archers...same thing here. Whatever works best for the player.

Chislev
June 27th, 2010, 05:41 PM
Hmmmmmm........................... I deffinitelly don't share the opinion of:


in et, ata alone dont need tank . tank mean possibility for die and lose xp . better lure and then hit. in this point,

Being able to tank doesn't make doing it an obligation, while not being able to tank mean too high chances of dying, hence loosing XP, to be acceptable.

How? Easy, let's see very few examples:

- the poor ata who cannot tank can have a lag ---> dead
- the same ata get caught by a mob that has been lyred along by some noob running around ---> dead
- the same ata, again and who's already starting to hate her owner, killed a mob fast and engaged a second one, there is an unnoticed respawn nearby and, for example, does a GC on the ata ---> dead

All those example would have been nothing more than a momentarily inconvenience for a properly raisen ata who can stand that kind of punishment without even blinking an eye, hence not loosing any XP due to external factors.

Being able to tank doesn't mean to be so stupid to go and stand in middle of a hellspawn pretending to be a tanker mechanician, plus it would be completely useless since no ata can handle so many mobs alltogether, not even in her wildest fantasy.

Viseris
June 27th, 2010, 06:54 PM
Hmm well I take on multiple ice 2 mobs at once without a sweat while doing AOE damage, not sure what you're talking about.

Also I havn't even died in ice 2 lol. That's the plus of having HP. Not getting 1 shot folks. When things have a 40% chance to hit me, and I have more hp than all of valento's attacks, I think I can tank, ty.

The point I am getting across is that I tank for a reason. To AoE mobs around me (aka X-rage). This isn't a cookie cutter build folks. If you like your build all the power to you.

Its sort of like Spark mechs to a degree. AOEing without moving. People fail to realize the time lost lining up mobs for storm and how weak (aka laggy) storm is in loc and higher maps.

Its not like I am trying to convert people to a new religion folks lol. Do as you please with your builds. However, I ask not to chastise others. Thanks.

ed teh gar
June 27th, 2010, 08:59 PM
Hmm well I take on multiple ice 2 mobs at once without a sweat while doing AOE damage, not sure what you're talking about.

Also I havn't even died in ice 2 lol. That's the plus of having HP. Not getting 1 shot folks. When things have a 40% chance to hit me, and I have more hp than all of valento's attacks, I think I can tank, ty.

The point I am getting across is that I tank for a reason. To AoE mobs around me (aka X-rage). This isn't a cookie cutter build folks. If you like your build all the power to you.

Its sort of like Spark mechs to a degree. AOEing without moving. People fail to realize the time lost lining up mobs for storm and how weak (aka laggy) storm is in loc and higher maps.

Its not like I am trying to convert people to a new religion folks lol. Do as you please with your builds. However, I ask not to chastise others. Thanks.

ice2 is not et.

Thats like saying

"hey look at me i can storm jav ds! that means i can storm jav loc!"

Viseris
June 27th, 2010, 11:10 PM
ice2 is not et.

Thats like saying

"hey look at me i can storm jav ds! that means i can storm jav loc!"

This dude's one heck of a troll. :P

ed teh gar
June 27th, 2010, 11:18 PM
This dude's one heck of a troll. :P

I guess that pointing out ulrika comment about your tactics not working in ET ( somene who made their own 10x ata. you know. someone with valid exp) and then you blabbing about ice2 ( an exp map. one where anyone with a full 80d set can tank 2-3 mobs easily) which makes no sense at all makes me a troll.

Im gonna add that i did most of my Exp in cave. and most of the time i was with an ata ( probably 80% of the time i level im with an ata) They all had full 80d sets but 80c armors for some of em but could easily tank 2-3 mobs without much trouble at base hp. Bragging about tanking in ice2 wont help your case.

I dont know why your usin ice2 as an example. it would be like a 7x using beehive cave as an example. Ice2 hasnt been a real hard map to be in since 2007/2008.

KushAndOrangeJuice
June 27th, 2010, 11:19 PM
I guess that pointing out ulrika comment about your tactics not working in ET ( somene who made their own 10x ata. you know. someone with valid exp) and then you blabbing about ice2 ( an exp map. one where anyone with a full 80d set can tank 2-3 mobs easily) which makes no sense at all makes me a troll.


This post is full of win.

ulrikaxD
June 28th, 2010, 01:31 AM
akitia, a sugesstion. do your test in ice1 with current build but using old items.. 80a. like in this very old video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iV_-qQdqTdI

i think result of your test, will be more reallist.. that using 80d in ice2 ;)

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 08:08 AM
I'm sure LoC will be an XP map when I'm 10x? You're point? The point is to "farm" lower level maps for quicker kills rather than 1on1ing here.

Of course Ata's with 400 HP cannot take multiple hits in ET lolz. Compare that with say an ata with ~ 1000 HP or so (if I would add merely 30 points into HP from level 92 ~100) That's 1000 hp base. However, I would not really be "soloing" ET at level 10x, but farming LoC, because the area kills would rack up faster.

And, I'm still not in full 80d lol, so I'm not sure what you people are trying to go on about. I could seriously make a strength archer that does more dmg than an ata, any day of the week. So if atas fall in 1 hit to ranged mobs, they are effectively weaksauce archers.

Chislev
June 28th, 2010, 11:41 AM
Uhm... i actually always had faster kills and took lesser damage damage in ET 1 or 2 than LoC or LT, monsters there has way too much absorb and HP and there are too many too powerfull ranged mobs there to feel comfortable playing there.

On the 80d thing, well, i don't see why anybody would go to ice 2 with less than 80c which is the actual equivalent to level 90 gear, hence the right set to go there. When it comes to ice2 and above, i've been there in 80d, level 100 and level 102 gear and, regarding atalante (and archer) it made no real difference.

ElSuperLobo
June 28th, 2010, 12:37 PM
I'm sure LoC will be an XP map when I'm 10x? You're point? The point is to "farm" lower level maps for quicker kills rather than 1on1ing here.

Of course Ata's with 400 HP cannot take multiple hits in ET lolz. Compare that with say an ata with ~ 1000 HP or so (if I would add merely 30 points into HP from level 92 ~100) That's 1000 hp base. However, I would not really be "soloing" ET at level 10x, but farming LoC, because the area kills would rack up faster.

And, I'm still not in full 80d lol, so I'm not sure what you people are trying to go on about. I could seriously make a strength archer that does more dmg than an ata, any day of the week. So if atas fall in 1 hit to ranged mobs, they are effectively weaksauce archers.


When u will shut up???.
U said u are old?, i think ur not and if u are u dont learn nothing through the years. U made a char that is not a tanker char, u make an ATA with a build that sucks.
Really that build dont allaw u to do nothing, u will never can get 10x by your own and u can never hunt someting with that build that really sucks.
U want to tank, u FAILED to make an ata, MAKE A MECH!!!!.

ed teh gar
June 28th, 2010, 01:20 PM
what will your build at 100 be? and what jav will you be using?

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 02:01 PM
Undecided...Probably 100 jav though. I mean quest jav.

ed teh gar
June 28th, 2010, 02:07 PM
154/64/90/168/208

thats for 1k hp at lv 100 dev gem shield q jav wearin a min st dev gem wyv with a perf sealed +3 set.

your damage will be incredibly low with only 168 into ag.

your not gonna AEO or kill anything any time soon.

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 04:48 PM
Well... I have way more agility than that lol. 1k HP is not even necessary. The tanking comes from mobs having less than a 40% chance to hit you.

Also, to me, D-Gem on armor is better than shield. But that's my opinion.

Bump: My HP is just fine at my current level (604 atm). To solo in ice2 without any threat of death, even taking devil bird's attacks head on. So I'm quite comfortable with my current setup. If anything, need to pump agility.

Lightsxo
June 28th, 2010, 05:00 PM
Well... I have way more agility than that lol. 1k HP is not even necessary. The tanking comes from mobs having less than a 40% chance to hit you.

Also, to me, D-Gem on armor is better than shield. But that's my opinion.

Bump: My HP is just fine at my current level (604 atm). To solo in ice2 without any threat of death, even taking devil bird's attacks head on. So I'm quite comfortable with my current setup. If anything, need to pump agility.

You have to be the most retarded person I've ever met.

If you want to tank, roll a Mech. ATA's aren't meant for tanking, and I guess since you're only level 91, you don't see that yet. Wait until you hit LoC, doesn't matter how much HP you got there lols. (At 95 at least)

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 05:04 PM
Actually you are wrong rofl. If I have more HP than any attack of a monster in the highest map I can visit it'd be kind of hard to die eh? :awsum:


I love this attention folks, keep it coming.

Lightsxo
June 28th, 2010, 05:15 PM
Actually you are wrong rofl. If I have more HP than any attack of a monster in the highest map I can visit it'd be kind of hard to die eh? :awsum:


I love this attention folks, keep it coming.

Until a second one spawns. Then you're fukked.

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 05:24 PM
Last time I checked, my weapons have a range over 300. Or in other words... I have a range of 720 degrees :P

HP is just a cushion, like car insurance or any type of insurance lol. Not mandatory...well maybe car insurance it depends where you live.


Also I think my prs is a better tanker than my ata oddly enough. I keep telling people VL adds hidden absorb, no one believes me.

Bump: But guys seriously...for ranged characters, DPS (Damage per second) goes down if you are running away from a monster, and that is why I tank when I can.

Lightsxo
June 28th, 2010, 05:31 PM
Last time I checked, my weapons have a range over 300. Or in other words... I have a range of 720 degrees :P

HP is just a cushion, like car insurance or any type of insurance lol. Not mandatory...well maybe car insurance it depends where you live.


Also I think my prs is a better tanker than my ata oddly enough. I keep telling people VL adds hidden absorb, no one believes me.

Bump: But guys seriously...for ranged characters, DPS (Damage per second) goes down if you are running away from a monster, and that is why I tank when I can.

http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/7249/11kdps.jpg

Get on my level. We aren't playing WoW, this is PT.

Don't be dumb. Prot pallies and Feral Druids are clearly the best tankers.

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 05:34 PM
Isn't advertising other MMO's in suba forums against the terms of service or something ? :awsum:

And second, no in-game achievement on any game is impressive to me. I defy logic. Do things my own way, despite what others tell me. That's what being a rebel is. Someone tells you this is the best way, I answer and take action my way even if its not the best way. That's how I am.

Lightsxo
June 28th, 2010, 05:37 PM
Isn't advertising other MMO's in suba forums against the terms of service or something ? :awsum:

Lol? By the way, you haven't ever been to LoC have you. Two dark guards, have fun tanking them, you will die with your "brilliant" build. Also, they have a range farther than you, and same with fireworms.

Viseris
June 28th, 2010, 05:40 PM
Ofcourse I havn't been there you idiot. Maybe in idk...40 stat points I will be 4 times better than I am now :P

Bump: And why do you think people are always requesting parties...(coughpikescough) in LOC and ET?

Because if people solo, (low leveled) more often than not they will die or its too much effort for them. Simple. Atalanta is a party character. They are stronger in a party, and their party is stronger in their presence. Or are you forgetting some area buff called "Hall of Valhalla"?

ulrikaxD
June 28th, 2010, 07:51 PM
people make party loc or party et.. coz in party xp is better than solo. no coz we can die alone. and... in party loc, 90% of ppl prefer and a prs before a ata, simple reason: VL.

about your build... after all is the same that hit and run.. u know why? u can tank mobs, or many mobs, and dont need run. but the time that a "normal" ata "waste" runing, u "waste" killing the mob.. know why? coz your damage is low :XD:

btw... i wanna see u tanking 2 dark phalanx + rangers.. (i just guess u dont care for just 2 little dark guard)

anyway.... i like your "idea" of find a new and different build, i guess u can modify this when enter in loc. 1 thing is read "u will die", and other thing is see how u are dying :'(

go go 95 for can test loc ;)

Lightsxo
June 28th, 2010, 07:55 PM
we make party loc or party et.. coz in party xp is better than solo. no coz we can die.
about your build... after all is the same that hit and run.. u know why? u can tank mobs, or many mobs, and dont need run. but the time that a "normal" ata "waste" runing, u "waste" killing the mob.. know why? coz your damage is low :XD:

btw... i wanna see u tanking 2 dark phalanx + rangers.. (i just guess u dont care for just 2 little dark guard)

anyway.... i like your "idea" of find a new and different build, i guess u can modify this when enter in loc. 1 thing is read "u will die", and other thing is see how u are dying :'(

go go 95 for can test loc ;)

I agree. The time is taken in tanking doesn't make up for your low attack power. It's about even out, but running would be faster, since you cannot tank more than one monster at a time in LoC anyways. I've seen 102 Ata's do it, but then again, full 102 = win.